"Peter and/or Tom,
You clearly have a double standard in enforcing message board policy. You are quick to yank my posts for any reason, including those that are perfectly valid but have been defaced by trolls, such as the Pam thread. That was the woman inquiring about club rides, in which you deleted the whole thread because several trolls jumped in after I posted a straightforward response.
Then you yanked my post from last night providing evidence as to why Anthony Donato is the troll who has been stalking me. This is not a gratuitous personal attack, unlike those many pointless jabs that pollute our MB and should be deleted immediately (but which you usually leave undisturbed).
It concerns the club at large--or ought to--that one member has consistently stalked another for months. I have substantiated my accusation by demonstrating a pattern of similarities between Anthony's signed and anonymous posts: frequent change of computer, and orthographic style. These recurrent characteristics could not be coincidental over the course of an entire year.
Discussions of MB policy are perfectly legitimate here as well. But you'll probably yank this thread too. That is, you selectively delete based not on principle, but on content that you don't agree with. Such censorship does nothing to enhance the quality of discourse, while it seeks to stifle original thought and dialogue.
Meanwhile, you've left in place Anthony's disgusting ""Cawk"" post on the South Beach thread. That's a creative misspelling of ""c*ck,"" in case you didn't know--and Peter, even if you don't mind a gross sexual innuendo being leveled and you and me together, I do.
It's time to change the way things are done on this MB. And talking about it would be a good place to start--if the censors will permit it."
Message Board's double standard
Anthony and others have been talked to in the past. What are you expecting us to do...seize their computer? Rub them out mafia style with frame pumps and used bike chains? Gag them with a stale PowerBar?
The solution is a very simple one. Ignore them. Maybe it is Anthony or maybe it is not. Perhaps it is more than one person. If you stop taking the bait, they'll lose interest and move on. Yes, indeed such inflammatory posts have been and will be removed.
On the other hand, it surely does not help that you reply in turn adding fuel to the flames. The thread you question - there was a rash of harsh replies posted in a short period of time and before I or Tom and others had a chance to review. A few of those replies were by none other than you.
What is your responsibility in this matter? How many times already has crying wolf happened? What conciliatory measures have you taken?
Ignore them. This has not been the first time this was suggested to you. Baiting them on, welcoming trouble and then repeatedly (over many months and incidences) asking for help is just not cool either.
This is a *recurring* problem only with you. You have been counseled on this many times in the past. Advice was given by many, but you fail to listen or acknowledge such. Instead it is more of the same vitriol for those trying to help. Frankly you can be too headstrong for your own good. It sad that you are unable to recognize this (emotional disorder) or incapable of such or both.
I'm sure you will have plenty to say. Replying to you, I will not (see last paragraph as to why). Frankly, I'm not interested at this point as it has all been said before by you or by other concerned parties. There's nothing new here. It's pretty much the same story and predictably repetitive behavior each time - deja vu all over again and again and again.
Peter O'Reilly
(the Fall guy)
amen
Firstly, the powers-that-be behind this MB do a great job. We have a fine site, modern, informative, fun and responsive to input. Hurray for all of you!!!!
Naturally, all that is sometimes diluted. The dilution occurs for a variety of reasons, but is generally centered around anonymous posts. Anonymity itself is not the culprit, but rather the abuse of anonymity – the trolls. Some of the faceless posts are fine - responsive, informative and funny – in tune with the camaraderie we should expect. So what if the dissemination is authored by a Goon or a Koch or a Shymember or anyone else who withholds a name! It is the crude rude posts betraying so much grudge, animosity and nihilism that get people’s dander up.
Further, the outcry against anonymity waxes and wanes, depending on who is saying what about whom. As an example, and without taking sides, the tide that rose last year against VChan included many anonymous racist posts: go eat an egg roll, me so horny, is very funny, etc. Real sleazy stuff. But the folks here who decry anonymity never said a word about the racist anonymity when it was on their side, attacking VC. The racism was overlooked. Anonymity is attacked only when there is disagreement over the subject matter of a thread. A double standard. And the leadership supported it.
Another example, again without taking sides, was when someone anonymously attacked the SIG and some of the A leaders last year. Nasty posts flew forth and back, with many saying the SIG attacker was a coward for selecting anonymity. BUT, the anonymous posts that attacked the attacker were OK in their anonymity because they supported the SIG. Again a double standard, again supported from the top.
So, built into anonymity is a double standard. Good vs. bad = my side vs. your side. To edit these problems as they arise in specific posts and threads, as with Carol currently, only worsens the problem. I’m glad I do not have to do it.
I know this has been debated, ad nauseum, ad infinitum … but mostly ad hoc. We need a solution. We have new leadership now (Does that metter?). Either we accept anonymity with all its ups and downs. Or we require registration, where anonymity is preserved for posts, but not for the private registration. You register privately with your name and true email address and get a password and screen name. If you misbehave consistently, you are banned. Of course, you can re-do your cookies and perhaps re-register, but it is not that easy.
Or, leave it alone and accept the infrequent anon. poster who trolls.
Now, I can hear the sabers rattle and the fires roar. If you flame me, please don’t hurt my feelings :-( If you flame me anon., at least pick a creative pseudonym :-)
Forgive: I did not take into account the cost of registartion for NYCC - it may be prohibitive?
I just want a solution.
"vbulletin has been suggested in the past. it's the standard on the 'net. having a proprietary system in place is nice but the club needs to protect it's long term interests...where will we be when peter decides to move on?
vbulletin is flexible enough to handle all the club's needs. here's a list of registered sports pages that use it (a very small sample of the overall polularity of vbulletin):
http://www.vbulletin.com/links.php?catid=12
and that's just a sample of SPORTS message boards...there are tons of other sites that use vbulletin. it's cheap enough for the club to own and the interface is simple enough for current and future board members to be able to manage.
:)
don
jp wrote:
We need a solution. We have new leadership now (Does that metter?). Either we accept anonymity with all its ups and downs. Or we require registration, where anonymity is preserved for posts, but not for the private registration. You register privately with your name and true email address and get a password and screen name. If you misbehave consistently, you are banned. Of course, you can re-do your cookies and perhaps re-register, but it is not that easy.
"
"""Anonymity is the first resort of a survivor.""
-- Old Montenegrin Folk Saying
Your Pal,
Etoain"
"JP wrote: ""Some of the faceless posts are fine - responsive, informative and funny – in tune with the camaraderie we should expect. So what if the dissemination is authored by a Goon or a Koch or a Shymember or anyone else who withholds a name!""
Goon Koch is a person's actual name. Just do a Google search and you'll see. I'm not acquainted with him (he lives in Pennsylvania), but I've seen his posts on the iBOB list as well as here."
True enough. I've emailed with him as well.
He's a keen randonneur, as well. I bet Diane and/or Karl has met him in person.
- Christian
"Goon Koch is a real person? I remember several ""Goons"" and most of ""their"" posts were ... abrupt. But that's just another problem with anonymity when it gets abused - someone can post under someone else's name. Didn't we have a Jan Ullrich post a few times?? Right!
Ok, Goon Koch - but regarding the board issue? Or do you just wanna kick me? ;-("
"Hi,
I met Mr. Koch, Oct. 2002, after a Diane Goodwin ""populaire"" brevet, at a Frenchtown, NJ bike shop. He finished the 100plus kilometer ride way ahead of many. In fact, he kind enough treat us to his home cooking, a nice post-ride pasta or was it sweets. Tasty. Maybe he'll treat us again after another ride....
Alfredo"
As an anonymous poster, I request the board be kept as is!! Allowing anonymous postings has some drawbacks but generally encourages more people to participate and encourages perhaps more honest communication as well. It does require some monitoring when things get out of hand, but it can be well worth it, depending on the goals of the message board. If the board is intended only for NYCC members, registration may be warranted. However, if you want an active board and welcome posters who are just interested in cycle talk, and not neccessarily NYCC, leave it as is. To my knowledge this is the most lively cycling board around. (Maybe some of you can tell me if there are others?) I can see the board growing as there doesn't seem to be anything filling the need.
The kayaking community has a few very active message boards that serve the community extremely well. One in particular that you might check out www.boatertalk.com. I can post a question about virtually anything paddling related and get a half dozen responses from all over the world in a few hours.
~CS
"http://cyclingforums.com
stats as of sunday, 9:45pm:
Members: 32,822, Topics: 69,309, Posts: 476,213
note: that behemoth was created/managed with vbulletin!
:)
don"
